and thats why we let youths vote |
faceeater
Triple Ace
Registration Date: 11-17-2007
Posts: 201
Location: Manchester Race in game: Absorber
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and thats why we let youths vote |
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Message from joshk, on 11-16-2008 18:06
???????
This is something you said in a thread:
"yet another childish comment, EVERYTHING is controlable, one day you will lean this probs when you try to duck your first bill to the council.
ok you think im a prat, one day when your over 30 and have kids of your own you will understand, doesnt matter how clever kids are, there all thick "
And no we are not all thick. i am 13 years old and i am proberly an awful lot more smarter than you. i have even done stuff like build an engine from scratch. Have you ever done something like that,NO you have not. in fact i have been told that i am one of the smartest kids in my region (judging by the work ive done).
and i know kids who know far more than you could ever know. SO WHO ARE YOU TO SAY THAT WE ARE ALL THICK.
and im not even what any of my mates would call a nerd. and i have 100's of mates. SO NEXT TIME YOU SAY SOMETHING LIKE THAT, THINK ABOUT IT DUMB A**
__________________
The Half Blood Prince
DarrenShan
and this is my response
Message to joshk, on 11-16-2008 18:20
RE: ???????
and what do i do for a living child?? dont just make assumptions, fact all kids are dumb, im 33 and in the eyes of my dad i make stupid decisions, and his dad probs thought the same, as for building an engine, well done, just shows you follow instructions well, my son is 13 on christmas day, he used to play bw some players, will tell you he is very smart himself, he is very academic, but in the grand scheme of things he makes stupid mistakes, if we cast him off into the cold hard world to fend for himself he wouldnt last a week, as he lacks the life skills, and only life can teach you that, my argument was about safety on the net, and from some of the info ive seen on here i could find kids in real life, all im saying is think smarter and stay safe.
__________________ I like bloodwars just fine the way it is
but some ideas are worth a look at
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11-16-2008 18:48 |
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haz_dude
Junior Member
Registration Date: 05-18-2008
Posts: 12
Race in game: Cultist Clan: TSH
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no offence but 13??? you dont know anything.... not being mean but its true, no1 knows anything until they have lived properly, and at 13 you have not....
my 2 pence....
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11-16-2008 18:53 |
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Zer
Forum Ace
Registration Date: 10-01-2008
Posts: 75
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Mhmm faceeater your in a bad day today no? too many flaming posts and answers like those, well everyone knows that its probably cause you think kids here are taking something cause of their free time, it might be true but well this is not life, this is a game, like it or not it is like it is, join any game and you will see people on strong guilds/Clans/Assocaitions whatever you want to call them, its hard to get to the top spots but it can be done, but if you plan to play alone its practically impossible as this is a MMOG (Massive multiplayer online game), and multiplayer means you cant be the top alone.
And to this topic if its a PM what are you trying to do by posting it? just keeping the flaming go? i really think you should act more according to your age and stop the flaming wars with people so that way they might not say "Dumb" or "Stupid" mistakes as you call them. simply let them be and enjoy the agme
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11-16-2008 18:54 |
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faceeater
Triple Ace
Registration Date: 11-17-2007
Posts: 201
Location: Manchester Race in game: Absorber
Thread Starter
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RE: and thats why we let youths vote |
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what gets me is im not the one whos angry, it seems people have taken offence to me saying please stay safe and well, just think before you post.
ok last night i was slightly intoxacated, but i still think, you should be carefull, the worlds full of nutters
__________________ I like bloodwars just fine the way it is
but some ideas are worth a look at
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11-16-2008 19:00 |
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Pops
moderator...apparently
Registration Date: 10-22-2008
Posts: 652
Location: england Race in game: Absorber Clan: BoS
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no disrespect himself, im 18 and i might well have seen alot more than most people, not going into detail, but some people younger have alot more common sense and life experience.
__________________ No, you didn't imagine it, I DID just go there
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11-16-2008 19:04 |
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faceeater
Triple Ace
Registration Date: 11-17-2007
Posts: 201
Location: Manchester Race in game: Absorber
Thread Starter
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cool what are they called, we can use their help.
i can just see it now on the news tonight,
"the global crisis is over the credit crunch is no more, thanks to dave in grimsby aged 14" god bless dave
move over obama martin has just hit sweet 16
__________________ I like bloodwars just fine the way it is
but some ideas are worth a look at
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11-16-2008 19:09 |
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Pops
moderator...apparently
Registration Date: 10-22-2008
Posts: 652
Location: england Race in game: Absorber Clan: BoS
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actually, american constitution states you must be 35 to be president. and sometimes a problem takes a fresh look on things.
by the way, look out world, faceater knows everything about everything and because hes older, you dont know anything!!!!!!!
*awaiting warning*
__________________ No, you didn't imagine it, I DID just go there
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11-16-2008 19:14 |
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bobalob57
Viking
Registration Date: 12-16-2007
Posts: 505
Location: uk, cheshire Race in game: Absorber Clan: NIGHT
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quote: |
Originally posted by faceeater
cool what are they called, we can use their help.
i can just see it now on the news tonight,
"the global crisis is over the credit crunch is no more, thanks to dave in grimsby aged 14" god bless dave
move over obama martin has just hit sweet 16 |
you never no kids could come up with theorys to sove the credit crunch
i have had lots of life experiances, and people older than me have told me theirs. the most important lessons i have learned in my life which have and will always serve me well are make sure you have a plan B and keep your mouth shut and watch people and how to manipulate a situation t your own needs.
you might be 30 odd and full of lifes experiances, but why then do you feel the need to insult us?
instead of calling us thick, you could have started a post with a annicdote to draw us in, then explained to us that we should be carefull over the internet, possibly suggesting a few rules that we should follow, which would have been recieved much more possitivly
even the first line in the reply to joshk was partonising, 'and what do i do for a living child' him and all young adults deserve to be treated with respect, as they are often capable of matching things that an adult can do, they can think things over and look at it from a differant point of view, which should be considered. in the same way that it was unfair for men to treat women differantly, it is iunfair for a adult to treat children differantly
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11-16-2008 19:23 |
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Pops
moderator...apparently
Registration Date: 10-22-2008
Posts: 652
Location: england Race in game: Absorber Clan: BoS
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i can understand ur passion for wanting people to be safe, but ultimately only they can make that decision. people will arrange to meet no matter what safeguards are put in place, people will find ways to avoid them. i apologise for my previous comment, but tone it down a bit
__________________ No, you didn't imagine it, I DID just go there
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11-16-2008 19:35 |
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Tempest
Member
Registration Date: 05-19-2008
Posts: 47
Location: UK Race in game: Thoughtcatcher Clan: LGN
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I'm over 30
& all I can say is you cant please all the people all of the time.
get a new look on life take the attitude " tell someone who gives a s**t "
You can choose to ignore stuff sent through your inbox, it's called delete
Sorry if that sounds harsh but it's kind of my way, difficult to argue with yourself, however if you can manage it, they have fun "basket weaving" courses available through the NHS comes with a free happy jacket if your into desecrating cornflakes.
__________________ Quote C47 "Do not disturb unless the problem is serious"
I am always serious about my problems
In Game Name TEMPEST
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11-16-2008 19:38 |
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Cthulhu
Viking
Registration Date: 11-29-2007
Posts: 726
Location: UK Race in game: Absorber Clan: HL
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Face, I think you need to take a break. You are way to stressed by what is actually out of your control.
I'll start by saying - just so you don't accuse me of being a child in your argument against me - I am 38; so I think I warrant a level of "respect" according to your own opinion? Which I might like to add I don't always understand as it seems to vary according to the argument in point at the time.
Considering you are an adult, and you have children of your own, you don't seem to be very forgiving towards their mistakes (that is children in general - I do not intend to suppose how you are with your own kids).
These boards & this game is populated by a lot of kids, as are most online games. If you don't like interacting with them, or you find it too stressful then I suggest you retire from the games. Because shouting at them, calling them stupid, & being offensive is:
a) not very adult behavior on your own part
b) goes against the Daily Mail politics you seem to want to live by
c) not setting them an example they can learn from
A few weeks ago you were shouting about how someone with a naked picture on their profile was offensive & dangerous & liable to corrupt your children if they, by chance, saw it. (I saw the picture - it was no "offensive" - pointless, but not "offensive")
Yet only the other day your response to Liamb when he gave you a telling off for swearing on a public message board, was that swear words were in the dictionary therefore it is ok to use them.
Mate, ***newsflash*** - we are all born naked. A naked body is not offensive material; it is a natural state of being. If the picture had been of a naked person involved in some form of sexual act - that would have been offensive.
But if this is your moral standpoint, why do you then think it is ok if your kids might stumble across the fact that you swear at other kids?
Is the problem you have with the mods actually nothing to do with the way they enforce the rules of the board; but actually the fact that you either don't like being told you are wrong. Or you especially don't like being told you're wrong by someone younger than you?
Liamb had every right to censor that post, and tell you not to multi-post. That is his responsibility on this board, and he handles that role very well. Through your argument with him, you made yourself look more immature than you were remonstrating him to be.
I don't like the way some of the younger players talk or mouth off in this game, but at the end of the day, I don't care enough about it to let it stress me - why do you?
This board, game, and the WHOLE internet is currently governed by something called "FREEDOM OF SPEECH". Now if you don't like that fact - you need to log off and go read a book, or watch telly instead.
If you think you can change that fact by enforcing "control" as you call it in one of your other threads, then you really need to think again. Control is a concept - not an actuality; therefore it can not be enforced. I think you will most of the world's past dictators (if they were still alive) would actually agree with me on that.
Lastly, Face, I am not having a go at you. If you have strong beliefs about these things, then all power to you, and I don't think anyone (at least most people I've chatted with) on this website would not hold that against you either. But when you are expressing them to others, then just remember to be respectful.
I think I can safely say without question, that respect is something you earn, not something given to you just because you are older than someone else, or have more power, or can shout louder & longer than anyone else.
Now, take care of yourself... & each other.
__________________
HBS
ENCHANTMENT
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11-16-2008 20:25 |
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Apollo
The Light
Registration Date: 03-31-2008
Posts: 412
Location: England Race in game: Beastmaster Clan: Source/TFE
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hmm... well put C. 100% agree face we have had some laughs be4 and are pretty friendly with each other and respect u and hopefully u probably respect me now how old do you think I am if I told you I was a teenager would that affect our respect?
__________________ What we do in life...Echoes in Eternity.
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11-16-2008 20:40 |
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Tempest
Member
Registration Date: 05-19-2008
Posts: 47
Location: UK Race in game: Thoughtcatcher Clan: LGN
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Yes well put Cthulhu , oooohhh SW ... I have Jeans older than you
I need a new wardrobe
__________________ Quote C47 "Do not disturb unless the problem is serious"
I am always serious about my problems
In Game Name TEMPEST
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11-16-2008 20:44 |
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Apollo
The Light
Registration Date: 03-31-2008
Posts: 412
Location: England Race in game: Beastmaster Clan: Source/TFE
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quote: |
Originally posted by Stallis
Yes well put Cthulhu , oooohhh SW ... I have Jeans older than you
I need a new wardrobe
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lol I have jeans younger than you
2 can play that game
__________________ What we do in life...Echoes in Eternity.
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11-16-2008 20:45 |
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faceeater
Triple Ace
Registration Date: 11-17-2007
Posts: 201
Location: Manchester Race in game: Absorber
Thread Starter
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last post to sw volumac says hi
__________________ I like bloodwars just fine the way it is
but some ideas are worth a look at
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11-16-2008 20:46 |
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Apollo
The Light
Registration Date: 03-31-2008
Posts: 412
Location: England Race in game: Beastmaster Clan: Source/TFE
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why thankyou
and hi volumac how u doin m8
__________________ What we do in life...Echoes in Eternity.
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11-16-2008 20:52 |
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DeathRanger
Member
Registration Date: 07-08-2008
Posts: 30
Location: Manchester/Cardiff Race in game: Absorber Clan: TRC
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i understand both sides of the arguement here and see both have valid points! Indeed the older u get the wiser u get (with some exceptions haha) but it is not academicaly but more common sense and things like that! So yes i agree with face and hesp in that sense.
However! It is wrong to say that if u are older u are wiser and that younger people dont have life exp and so on! Im a dental student at uni so i would say that iam academic and know more about the body than 99% of u on here so would u call me thick??
And to make another point if someone collapsed on the floor in a fit how many of u "older" people would know what to do! Not many im sure even with your "life experience"! ITs all circumstantial wouldnt u say!
SOme younger people will be wiser than some older people etc!
On the whole older people will be more mature and have more life exp than younger, BUT it is not an absolute! So my point is dont make sweeping exagerations that clearly arent true!
thanks!
__________________ boo! =)
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11-16-2008 21:27 |
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Pops
moderator...apparently
Registration Date: 10-22-2008
Posts: 652
Location: england Race in game: Absorber Clan: BoS
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good point, well made. i personally would know what to do if someone collapsed on the floor.
__________________ No, you didn't imagine it, I DID just go there
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11-16-2008 21:34 |
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theheraldofogc
Viking
Registration Date: 02-27-2008
Posts: 598
Location: UK Race in game: Beastmaster Clan: -END-
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I'll say this.
No one likes being told they're immature.
I'm 24, and only worked out what I want to do with my life last year.
Some things only come with age. Some comments are insulting no matter how old you are.
To be subjective, I agree with faceeater's message but they could do with work on how they deliver it.
Always something new to learn
__________________ UK Underworld: theheraldofogc - Black Knight
UK Underworld: Beta - Sniper
UK Underworld: Mini Herald - Gunman
PL Moria III: The Herald - Hunter
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11-16-2008 23:57 |
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Raxis
Set Abominae
Registration Date: 12-12-2007
Posts: 1,168
Race in game: Beastmaster
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quote: |
SOme younger people will be wiser than some older people etc!
On the whole older people will be more mature and have more life exp than younger, BUT it is not an absolute! So my point is dont make sweeping exagerations that clearly arent true! |
being completely honest here, I can see both sides. But then I've noticed a lot of people older than me forget basic common sense because they get hyped up on the fact they are 'older and wiser', I think it really does change. There is no such thing as common sense, after all if there was George Bush and Tony Blair would never have made offices (got my laugh in)
I have first aid training too, I also have powers of arrest and know what to do in security situations, most of which I figured out without triaing, then refined it at my new job. I have also seen a lot of things I wish I hadn't and will not go into, and also have the sense to knwo how to knock about really rough areas without any trouble. Common sense is only how far you believe it is.
Faceeater, calm thyself, yoiu'll give yourself a heart attack over bloodwars
__________________ Create the infinite and expand the question.
Count to number seven.
Your day of rest creates infection,
Your imperfection.
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11-16-2008 23:57 |
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Pops
moderator...apparently
Registration Date: 10-22-2008
Posts: 652
Location: england Race in game: Absorber Clan: BoS
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on the subject of vote, why is it fair that a 16 year old who works cannot vote, yet a 25 year old who never worked can? the 16 year old is contributing to the government he pays taxes too, yet the 25 year old is sponging from it and yet he/she gets a say in how it is run? thats out of order. i knew more about politics at 16 than some of my neighbours. can somebody also explain how its ok to give birth and get married at 16, yet 18 to buy a beer, 17 to drive a car. it doesnt make sense at all
__________________ No, you didn't imagine it, I DID just go there
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11-17-2008 00:59 |
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Raxis
Set Abominae
Registration Date: 12-12-2007
Posts: 1,168
Race in game: Beastmaster
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quote: |
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on the subject of vote, why is it fair that a 16 year old who works cannot vote, yet a 25 year old who never worked can? the 16 year old is contributing to the government he pays taxes too, yet the 25 year old is sponging from it and yet he/she gets a say in how it is run? thats out of order. i knew more about politics at 16 than some of my neighbours. can somebody also explain how its ok to give birth and get married at 16, yet 18 to buy a beer, 17 to drive a car. it doesnt make sense at all |
Popeye I here ya. Try this one, why is it at sixteen you can be charged under the full view of the law, yet you cannot vote on those laws until eighteen.
16 you shouldnt pay tax! At least not unless you are on a huge wage (or not english), I pay my tax, I havent had trhe oppertunity tovote, but I will make damn sure Labour dont get mine.
Don't even let me get started on spongers...
__________________ Create the infinite and expand the question.
Count to number seven.
Your day of rest creates infection,
Your imperfection.
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11-17-2008 01:03 |
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Lysandra
Viking
Registration Date: 01-11-2008
Posts: 531
Location: Canada Race in game: Beastmaster
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Adding my two cents....
I agree that some kids/teens can be really...not so much dumb, more of immature. I've seen a lot of people under the age of sixteen act like 3 years olds, throwing a temper tantrum when they don't get what they want. On the flip side, I've seen a few over 25 year olds do the same (makes for interesting conversation...lol.)
I think maturity and 'dumbness' is never and can never be determined by age. It is only determined by a person's life experience and what they've seen in their lives. I've been told I have the mind-set of a 28 year-old and I'm 18.
The only reason I agree on the voting age being 18 is because I see way too many immature under 18 years old who would only vote by popularity not the actual issuse. Mind you, there are a few under the age of 18 who work and contribute to the government and who by all rights should be able to vote if they are mature enough to make informed decisions.
I would suggest that where voting is concerned people under the age of 18 should be allowed to take a 'maturity' test. If they can answer simple questions about the political parties and prove that they have the maturity to make informed decisions then they should be allowed to vote.
I have opposing views on what Raxis said as well, I do agree to a certain extent that if you're under 18 and can't vote on laws you shouldn't be charged as an adult. That being said, something like that could mean we can have 17 year-olds commiting very extensive crimes and only be let off with a slap on the wrist where they should get more then that. My view is that if you're old enough to understand why the crime is so horrible and are capable of commiting that crime (even if you're 16 or 17) then you should be charged as an adult.
And don't get me started on spongers. Had to live with spongers for most of my teenage life while my brother and I did all the work around the house.
__________________ Former leader of the Family of Darkness.
Buying titanium neckwear of accuracy. PM in game.
Check out my website: www.vonravenstone.com
quote: |
Originally posted by *GayTiger*
lys... that was amazing, it's pure orgasm on a page!
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11-19-2008 17:56 |
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Lysandra
Viking
Registration Date: 01-11-2008
Posts: 531
Location: Canada Race in game: Beastmaster
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quote: |
Originally posted by popeye2k8
the same thing with wages. the tiered minimum wage, why does a 16 year old doing the same job as a 12 year old get paid less? you could say experience, but why is it automatic? we couldve started on the same day. life experience? the 16 year old couldve been in care, had a shit childhood and had to fend for themself, while 21 yr old had a great life with parents and never had to work a day in their life |
I think you're right there (and I'm pretty sure you mean 21 year old in the first bit too
) but they can't adjust people's wages based on life experience. Even though the 16 year old needs the money a lot more then the 21 year old, the only way for the 16 year old to get more money is to work more. They won't make minium wage even across all ages because they figure most people under the age of 18 (that's when our pay increases here) have parents who look after them.
Trust me I know what an annoyance it is to have to work longer hours to get the money I need when someone who's just working because their parents told them to get a job and doesn't need the money gets paid more.
__________________ Former leader of the Family of Darkness.
Buying titanium neckwear of accuracy. PM in game.
Check out my website: www.vonravenstone.com
quote: |
Originally posted by *GayTiger*
lys... that was amazing, it's pure orgasm on a page!
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11-19-2008 18:54 |
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bobalob57
Viking
Registration Date: 12-16-2007
Posts: 505
Location: uk, cheshire Race in game: Absorber Clan: NIGHT
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quote: |
Originally posted by Lysandra
something like that could mean we can have 17 year-olds commiting very extensive crimes and only be let off with a slap on the wrist where they should get more then that. |
that basically already happens in britian
some examples are that one person caught carrying a meat clever was fined £167, and out of 10,706 arrests for knife crime in 2006 3,007where let off without a warning, 6,320 were found guilty but only 995 were sent to prison.
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11-19-2008 19:15 |
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Pops
moderator...apparently
Registration Date: 10-22-2008
Posts: 652
Location: england Race in game: Absorber Clan: BoS
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britains structure is a joke. thanks for picking that up lys. lol. a 16 year old here does have financial commitments. but a 21 year old could have a child. i think there should be no tiered system. should be even across the board. what is minimum wage in the states?
__________________ No, you didn't imagine it, I DID just go there
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11-19-2008 19:26 |
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Lysandra
Viking
Registration Date: 01-11-2008
Posts: 531
Location: Canada Race in game: Beastmaster
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@ Bob- well dang... I mean yeah we have school shootings and such but from what I hear (and I could be wrong i'm not a news junkie) we don't have anything that even comes close to that.
@Popeye- lol, no problem. I believe minimum wage (in Canada) is $9 which works out to uh... 18 pounds.... I think. I suddenly blanked on my currancey conversion...lol.
I don't think it will ever be tiered evenly (meaning a 16 year old makes the same minimum wage as a 21 year old) plain and simply because most people under the age of 18 still live with their parents and don't need the money to support themselves where as most people over the age of 18 are living on their own and need money for rent, food ext. That's the general belief of the government (who dictates our wages) so really they'll never make it even across all boards.
I understand a select few under the age of 18 have financal (urg can't spell) responsibilities, heck Lest and I had major responsiblities when we were 16. But it's a very select few and the government won't change for a handful of people.
__________________ Former leader of the Family of Darkness.
Buying titanium neckwear of accuracy. PM in game.
Check out my website: www.vonravenstone.com
quote: |
Originally posted by *GayTiger*
lys... that was amazing, it's pure orgasm on a page!
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11-19-2008 20:10 |
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Pops
moderator...apparently
Registration Date: 10-22-2008
Posts: 652
Location: england Race in game: Absorber Clan: BoS
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it works out as roughly £4.50. i think they should at least level it out a bit. which is about what our 18 year olds are entitled to. which seems wierd, as the cost of living in the states is lower.
__________________ No, you didn't imagine it, I DID just go there
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11-19-2008 20:20 |
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Lysandra
Viking
Registration Date: 01-11-2008
Posts: 531
Location: Canada Race in game: Beastmaster
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Well when I was 17 I was getting student wage which was about $6.50. When I turned 18 I got the $7.25 I was entiled to. I could be wrong because I had slight raises and such in between.
lol at cost of living being cheaper here. it's $7 for 4 liters of milk, $3 for a loaf of bread in some stores. then again I'm not sure what your prices are like overseas so that might seem cheap to you....lol.
For one weeks groceries it costs about $180-220...mind you I live with two guys who eat like the foods going to run away on them....LOL.
I do agree that it should be leveled out though, I mean age doesn't dicate finacial need either.
I love that we randomly wandered off topic...lol.
__________________ Former leader of the Family of Darkness.
Buying titanium neckwear of accuracy. PM in game.
Check out my website: www.vonravenstone.com
quote: |
Originally posted by *GayTiger*
lys... that was amazing, it's pure orgasm on a page!
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11-19-2008 20:34 |
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bobalob57
Viking
Registration Date: 12-16-2007
Posts: 505
Location: uk, cheshire Race in game: Absorber Clan: NIGHT
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i fear that pertol prices may begin to rise a bit soon, although it is nice to see that its gone back down to under a pound a litre
why? due to increased pirate activity and the recent capture of a oil anker of the coast of somile, i have a feeling that insurence companys will begin to raise the prices on insurunce for cargos as they are worried about making a loss, if more tankers where captured for example.
s a result the extra prices will be passed on to us, forcing prices to rise again, if the worst comes to the worst, then saudi arabie may reduce its exports of oil due to the danger of it being captured, and that will cause prices to skyrocket
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11-19-2008 22:50 |
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Raxis
Set Abominae
Registration Date: 12-12-2007
Posts: 1,168
Race in game: Beastmaster
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quote: |
the 16 year old couldve been in care, had a shit childhood and had to fend for themself, while 21 yr old had a great life with parents and never had to work a day in their life
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I know the main reason for thisa... it's tax. A 16 year old does not get taxed anywhere near as heavily as an eighteen year old, and I believe in certain sectors there is another tax bracket at 21. Also it used to be once people were 21 they were looking to buy their own house.
Tell me htis, Petrol prices lost about 15 pence, but why was i such a small drop in comparision to the halving of cost of crude oil?
Also petrol you get taxed for paying tax
__________________ Create the infinite and expand the question.
Count to number seven.
Your day of rest creates infection,
Your imperfection.
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11-19-2008 22:55 |
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Lysandra
Viking
Registration Date: 01-11-2008
Posts: 531
Location: Canada Race in game: Beastmaster
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@ popeye- okay good point...lol we are in off topic anyway so hey.
And those prices seem about equal to what we have here, unless of course my currency converter is off again.
@bob Petrol (gas for us in North America) is at about 80 cents a liter...so seems about the same. Oddly enough in the United States (the country under mine
) their gas prices are still hitting about a dollar or more in some states. Good thing I live in a country that actually has oil reserves. Good old Alberta...lol.
I've never really had the need to complain about gas prices because the car I drive is very fuel efficent and only take about $16-20 a week to fill the tank.
__________________ Former leader of the Family of Darkness.
Buying titanium neckwear of accuracy. PM in game.
Check out my website: www.vonravenstone.com
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Originally posted by *GayTiger*
lys... that was amazing, it's pure orgasm on a page!
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11-19-2008 23:00 |
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