Official Blood Wars Board | Game system

Official Blood Wars Board » Blood Wars » Game system » Splitting stones

» Hello Guest [Login|Register]

Last Post | First Unread Post

Print Page | Recommend to a Friend | Add Thread to Favorites

Pages (2): [1] 2 next »

Splitting stones

Author

Post

« Previous Thread | Next Thread »

Mortis
Emperor

Registration Date: 05-01-2007
Posts: 1,159
Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: BoS exLead

Splitting stones

Patch v.0.96d from 8 March 2007
Added possibility of splitting better stones into lesser ones in ratio 1/2.

This is true for Soulstone and Bloodstone, but for Mergestone and Lifestone it isn't.

For 150BS you will get only 61BS which is quite far from 50%, in fact its only 40%.

So I suggest to change it to closer to 50%. My suggestion is 1LS, 2HS and 5BS which would be more accurate splitting and makes it more worthy.

edit: yeah, thx scillage

__________________
"The brightest light is invisible. It shines through your deeds. And warms the universe."

"Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind."

This post has been edited 2 time(s), it was last edited by Mortis: 02-02-2009 17:30.

01-29-2009 12:43

Scillage
Forum Legend

Registration Date: 05-31-2007
Posts: 1,034
Location: UK
Clan: N/A

I have thought about this before and meant to put it up on the boards but I forgot to. I think 1LS 2HS 5BS would be fairer Wink

__________________

Decir adiós es morir un poco
To say goodbye is to die a little

01-29-2009 12:45

Evangelion
The warning machine

Registration Date: 03-01-2007
Posts: 1,131
Location: Poland
Race in game: Beastmaster
Clan: BoS

Well, if my calculations are good then you get back 1 lifestone (50) and half of lifestone already splitted by the well (half from 2 bloodstones and 2 heartstones) and that's really unfair.

__________________

All complaints on all the Moderators should be sent to me via

PM rules = who is who and what may be reported to whom

"Getting old is mandatory... being mature is optional"

01-29-2009 12:56

True_Enigma
Member

Registration Date: 08-02-2008
Posts: 41
Location: Ireland
Race in game: Thoughtcatcher
Clan: -END-

I agree, it needs to be changed to be more fair. I agree with Mortis and Scillage. Smile

__________________

This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by True_Enigma: 01-29-2009 14:35.

01-29-2009 14:35

Mortis
Emperor

Registration Date: 05-01-2007
Posts: 1,159
Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: BoS exLead

Thread Starter Thread Started by Mortis

Guys, I would like to hear some more support. Where are you BW players?

And also some words from Dev team would be also nice to see.

__________________
"The brightest light is invisible. It shines through your deeds. And warms the universe."

"Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind."

01-31-2009 23:55

DemonDude2
Lord

Registration Date: 11-18-2008
Posts: 483
Location: United Counties of Ireland :D
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: >:D

They said 1/2 ratio and this isnt right!!

Only a slight number error!! Hopefully they'll fix it soon.

__________________

'Imagine waking up, and finding out you have the wrong blankey'

02-01-2009 00:34

bobalob57
Viking

Registration Date: 12-16-2007
Posts: 505
Location: uk, cheshire
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: NIGHT

i agree, i don't know why the stones are split this way
just offering my support

02-01-2009 00:37

Ba_al
Viking

Registration Date: 08-05-2008
Posts: 618
Location: Ireland :bulmers cider factory
Race in game: Cultist
Clan: DB

thiis prob should be fixed soon in my opinion..ive nevr broke down a ms so have never actually noticed this lol

im suprised it went on for as long as it did without any mentioning it.
will it be fixed though that is the question??????

would like to hear from the powers that be...

__________________
in-game-name
underworld: Ba_alzamon
I have a rich caramel filling
Founding father and former leader of ENDBRINGERS

DraGan 15:51 -> the time is never important, only the destination , thats how bal rolls Big Grin

02-01-2009 04:05

blackcat
Triple Ace

Registration Date: 05-11-2008
Posts: 190
Location: IRELAND
Race in game: Beastmaster
Clan: end

it would want to be fixed but now that i realise they are robbong stones off us and thats not very fair is it i want all my stone back it should be a small amount but its more than what i have already

__________________
those that have never made a mistake have never tried anything new

archimage on underworld riddler on necro

02-01-2009 11:03

Cthulhu
Viking

Registration Date: 11-29-2007
Posts: 726
Location: UK
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: HL

I agree - thanks Mortis for raising the issue - clearly the BW devs have an issue with percentages - its not the only game percentage that seems a little out! Tongue

Can we have the correct ratio please BW Team.

__________________

HBS

ENCHANTMENT

02-01-2009 14:12

Szeszej
Administrator

Registration Date: 02-21-2007
Posts: 1,863
Location: Poland
Clan: Overlords

I can try to explain but I'm not a mathematician myself Wink

1 ms is split into 1.5 ls

we can't give you .5 ls so we would need to split ls (or else you would get nothing) into 2.5 hs BUT remember that when we split stones half of them is lost ALWAYS so what you get is 1.25 hs

we again can't give you .25 hs so we slit the hs again so can get any stones and from this splitting you get 0.25*5bs=1.25bs rounded down to 1bs

__________________

Before sending a PM, read the PM rules
If Supermoderators or moderators do not listen or unjustly ignore your PMs, write a PM to me.
Heresy grows from idleness.

02-01-2009 22:38

Azz420
Lord

Registration Date: 04-11-2007
Posts: 384
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: .DB.

quote:

Originally posted by Szeszej
I can try to explain but I'm not a mathematician myself Wink

Whats this then ???
Soulstone = 1x Mergestone + 2x Lifestone

1SS is split onto 1.66MS

but you cant give .66 of a MS so you have to split it into 2 LS BUT remember then when we split stones half of them is lost ALWAYS !!! so what you get is 1LS

so what we should get is....
Soulstone = 1x Mergestone + 1x Lifestone

end of.

Prolly shooting myself in the foot for saying all this
so cash in your SS before they tax us even more !!!!

__________________

02-01-2009 23:48

Kleks
Forum Ace

Registration Date: 04-21-2007
Posts: 96
Location: R2 Belfegorv2
Race in game: Thoughtcatcher
Clan: A.S

Right there is not big math here.

Let us just refresh our memories
1 SS = 500
1 MS = 150
1 LS = 50
1 HS = 10

Ok then so
half of SS
500/2 = 250 - MS+2LS
half of MS
150/2 = 75 - LS+2HS+5BS
half of LS
50/2 = 25 - 2HS+5BS
half of HS
10/2 = 5 - 5 BS

And what we got now is:
for 1 SS
1 MS + 2 LS - Correct - 250
for 1 MS
1 LS + 1 HS + 1 BS - WRONG - 61
for LS
2 HS and 2 BS - WRONG - 22
for HS
5 BS - correct

So if someone would like to change SS only for BS then he will loose 33 BS in process and we will end up with 42 BS in total instead of 75

__________________
Commitment - Helping newbies

This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Kleks: 02-02-2009 01:40.

02-02-2009 00:43

Szeszej
Administrator

Registration Date: 02-21-2007
Posts: 1,863
Location: Poland
Clan: Overlords

You are wronly assuming that we count each stone's worth in bs to determine how they should be split.

__________________

Before sending a PM, read the PM rules
If Supermoderators or moderators do not listen or unjustly ignore your PMs, write a PM to me.
Heresy grows from idleness.

02-02-2009 01:44

Kleks
Forum Ace

Registration Date: 04-21-2007
Posts: 96
Location: R2 Belfegorv2
Race in game: Thoughtcatcher
Clan: A.S

RE: Splitting stones

quote:

Originally posted by Mortis
Patch v.0.96d from 8 March 2007
Added possibility of splitting better stones into lesser ones in ratio 1/2.

But isn't it said that ratio is 1/2?
And the smallest stone counts in 1 is BS
So why in case of ratio 1/2 MS that is worth 150 in case of stones is worth 1 LS 1 HS and 1 BS that's overal 61, a 14 less than it actual 1/2 ratio should be.

__________________
Commitment - Helping newbies

02-02-2009 01:53

Szeszej
Administrator

Registration Date: 02-21-2007
Posts: 1,863
Location: Poland
Clan: Overlords

Well, you are again wrongly assuming that we take stone's worth in bs to detemine how it should be split. Please read my post above on how it is done.

__________________

Before sending a PM, read the PM rules
If Supermoderators or moderators do not listen or unjustly ignore your PMs, write a PM to me.
Heresy grows from idleness.

02-02-2009 01:55

Artoir.
Avenger

Registration Date: 02-24-2008
Posts: 1,111
Location: Ireland
Race in game: Beastmaster
Clan: V13

quote:

Originally posted by Azz420

quote:

Originally posted by Szeszej
I can try to explain but I'm not a mathematician myself Wink

Then can you answer this?

__________________

02-02-2009 01:56

Kleks
Forum Ace

Registration Date: 04-21-2007
Posts: 96
Location: R2 Belfegorv2
Race in game: Thoughtcatcher
Clan: A.S

So maby a cosmetic change on patch description from

Added possibility of splitting better stones into lesser ones in ratio 1/2.

should be changed then to

Added possibility of splitting better stones into lesser ones in ratio about 1/2.

So it'll avoid further complains.

__________________
Commitment - Helping newbies

02-02-2009 01:59

Cthulhu
Viking

Registration Date: 11-29-2007
Posts: 726
Location: UK
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: HL

quote:

Originally posted by Szeszej
You are wronly assuming that we count each stone's worth in bs to determine how they should be split.

Err, can I just say, that you are wrong.

1) The whole auction system works on BS - when you place a bid, you have to do in BS, and calculate the equivalent in higher stones.

2 )When you change stones UP into higher stones in the well of souls (now re-named the Bottomless Well of Lost Souls by Evan) - that change is calculated in their BS RATE.

Bloodstone x 10 = Heartstone = 10 BS
Heartstone x 5 = Lifestone = 50 BS
Lifestone x 3 = Mergestone = 150 BS
Mergestone x 2 + Lifestone x 4 = Soulstone = 500 BS

SO, why is it WRONG that we assume the BW Team would gives a FAIR rate of exchange back in BS.

I can think of another term tha BS stands for, and I am smelling it right now. Pull your finger out BW Team - if you say it is 1/2 of the stones value, then make it that - and not some fudging excuse about you can't split the amounts down correctly. Mad

__________________

HBS

ENCHANTMENT

02-02-2009 09:17

Szeszej
Administrator

Registration Date: 02-21-2007
Posts: 1,863
Location: Poland
Clan: Overlords

Depends on the definition of fair tbh Wink

I've explained in my post why the ratio is still 1/2 with our system, if we wanted you to change soulstones directly into bs we'd add such option.

__________________

Before sending a PM, read the PM rules
If Supermoderators or moderators do not listen or unjustly ignore your PMs, write a PM to me.
Heresy grows from idleness.

02-02-2009 16:50

Mortis
Emperor

Registration Date: 05-01-2007
Posts: 1,159
Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: BoS exLead

Thread Starter Thread Started by Mortis

quote:

Originally posted by Szeszej
You are wronly assuming that we count each stone's worth in bs to determine how they should be split.

then how have you calculated this?

quote:

Originally posted by Szeszej
1 ms is split into 1.5 ls

and your system is far from 1/2 ratio and definition of fairness is quite simple..

__________________
"The brightest light is invisible. It shines through your deeds. And warms the universe."

"Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind."

This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Mortis: 02-02-2009 16:59.

02-02-2009 16:54

Azz420
Lord

Registration Date: 04-11-2007
Posts: 384
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: .DB.

i wont split stones because of the massive loses
well maybe a few HS but thats my limit
id rather keep MS and SS for auctions and merges

if you want a better rate buy good items for from auction SS
and sell for 5LS (turn of MS and SS, hell and HS too)

__________________

02-02-2009 17:22

Kleks
Forum Ace

Registration Date: 04-21-2007
Posts: 96
Location: R2 Belfegorv2
Race in game: Thoughtcatcher
Clan: A.S

quote:

Originally posted by Szeszej
Depends on the definition of fair tbh Wink

I've explained in my post why the ratio is still 1/2 with our system, if we wanted you to change soulstones directly into bs we'd add such option.

Don't be sarcastic, what i wrote was a simple example how unfair for us players that ratio is and how much actually stones we loose if we might choose to disolve them to lesser ones.
But instead adding such pointless option better to change current ones and by change i mean reconsider that ratio.

So enlight me please you havn't consider in that 1/2 ratio actual value of stones but instead the type of stones?

Alright then is you want to play this like that then do the very same math with same algorithm opposite.
Let us pay to create MS not 3 LS but those 2 LS 2 HS and 2 BS

Quid pro quo Szeszej, you stripped us from stones so give us THE actual 1/2 ratio.

__________________
Commitment - Helping newbies

This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Kleks: 02-02-2009 21:51.

02-02-2009 21:45

spawnraloom
Triple Ace

Registration Date: 09-11-2008
Posts: 180
Clan: the JOKERs

quote:

Originally posted by Szeszej
Depends on the definition of fair tbh Wink

dusent this some up the whole game???

__________________
have fun good luck, and don't lose to much blood

02-02-2009 21:56

DemonDude2
Lord

Registration Date: 11-18-2008
Posts: 483
Location: United Counties of Ireland :D
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: >:D

quote:

Originally posted by Kleks
Alright then is you want to play this like that then do the very same math with same algorithm opposite.
Let us pay to create MS not 3 LS but those 2 LS 2 HS and 2 BS

Now thats an idea!! =D

Embaressing math mistake, i dont think they wana look silly here as if they admit their wrong, they think it will leave their entire system up to subject... But its clear they are wrong, and even though the players continusly give new different reasons of how this doesnt work, their answer

'I already said why' ... 'Its just the way we work it' ... IE, not the way they said in the patch!! =O

__________________

'Imagine waking up, and finding out you have the wrong blankey'

This post has been edited 3 time(s), it was last edited by DemonDude2: 02-02-2009 22:05.

02-02-2009 22:04

diablo
The contract has expired - former moderator.

Registration Date: 07-05-2007
Posts: 1,275
Location: Hell
Race in game: Cultist
Clan: BoS

I don't care what you think is fair Szeszej, if the patch says 1/2 ratio than just say you're sorry and correct it or make another patch (or change the words) and look, well, incompetent. Good luck with the solution.

__________________

02-02-2009 22:28

Kleks
Forum Ace

Registration Date: 04-21-2007
Posts: 96
Location: R2 Belfegorv2
Race in game: Thoughtcatcher
Clan: A.S

Discrediting dev team is my last intention but either that ratio 1/2 was a one big misunderstanding in vocabulary or someone just made that algorithm with one hand in poo.

But really... What would be the next action?
Do dev team will fix those ratios including value of stones itself or lower the cost of creating MS and LS ??

At the moment i can even cosider this as a game bug a misfortune of programmer responsible for that particular lines of coding.

This isn't a random algorithm or luck in quest problem, this problem actually inflict all players and game itself.

__________________
Commitment - Helping newbies

02-02-2009 22:33

diablo
The contract has expired - former moderator.

Registration Date: 07-05-2007
Posts: 1,275
Location: Hell
Race in game: Cultist
Clan: BoS

quote:

Originally posted by Kleks
But really... What would be the next action?

Guess...

I was not trying to discredit the Devs, but a more serious answer than 'tbh, whats fair?' was expected while raising such a point as Mortis did. As you say, it affects the whole server(s).

__________________

02-02-2009 23:03

Kleks
Forum Ace

Registration Date: 04-21-2007
Posts: 96
Location: R2 Belfegorv2
Race in game: Thoughtcatcher
Clan: A.S

Well szeszej definitely was on board as he put eve on pillory...

But it seems like in very most cases when problem is to hot he rather not to comment at all.

Yet again after feeding us with "Depends on definition of fair"
Sarcastic "...if we wanted you to change soulstones directly into bs we'd add such option."
And completely avoidable answer "You are wronly assuming that we count each stone's worth in bs to determine how they should be split." for a direct question.

We are left (not the first time) with complete ignorance from dev side as any comment would mean either that they really don't care about our opinion and do their stuff as they want or if they admit the unfair system in well of souls, then players will prove their rights.

Szeszej i'm waiting for comments on this but not only for this reply but for THIS.

quote:

So enlight me please you havn't consider in that 1/2 ratio actual value of stones but instead the type of stones?

Alright then is you want to play this like that then do the very same math with same algorithm opposite.
Let us pay to create MS not 3 LS but those 2 LS 2 HS and 2 BS

Quid pro quo Szeszej, you stripped us from stones so give us THE actual 1/2 ratio.

__________________
Commitment - Helping newbies

02-04-2009 23:45

Mortis
Emperor

Registration Date: 05-01-2007
Posts: 1,159
Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: BoS exLead

Thread Starter Thread Started by Mortis

Szeszej is obviously too busy for this so let C47 answer it. I am really eager to see him in action.

__________________
"The brightest light is invisible. It shines through your deeds. And warms the universe."

"Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind."

02-05-2009 00:52

Szeszej
Administrator

Registration Date: 02-21-2007
Posts: 1,863
Location: Poland
Clan: Overlords

I've already answered and you, as I can see, haven't read what I have written thoroughly. Please do so and everything will be clear.

__________________

Before sending a PM, read the PM rules
If Supermoderators or moderators do not listen or unjustly ignore your PMs, write a PM to me.
Heresy grows from idleness.

02-05-2009 01:57

Mortis
Emperor

Registration Date: 05-01-2007
Posts: 1,159
Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: BoS exLead

Thread Starter Thread Started by Mortis

Not really. You have chosen to answer only one part, so now read properly what we have written and try to answer all. Show me by your logic how you split Soulstone.

__________________
"The brightest light is invisible. It shines through your deeds. And warms the universe."

"Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind."

02-05-2009 08:30

Tempest
Member

Registration Date: 05-19-2008
Posts: 47
Location: UK
Race in game: Thoughtcatcher
Clan: LGN

A few stones more has always got to be a good thing especially the amount used with ritual of blood Confused

think that needs looking at too JMO Mad

__________________
Quote C47 "Do not disturb unless the problem is serious"
I am always serious about my problems Big Grin

In Game Name TEMPEST

02-05-2009 09:58

Szeszej
Administrator

Registration Date: 02-21-2007
Posts: 1,863
Location: Poland
Clan: Overlords

Soulstone = 1x Mergestone + 2x Lifestone

I think you still don't get it. Remember that if you wanted to split this soulstone further you would still get ~50% of what is worth so effectively if you split soulstone twice you get 25% of what it was originally worth. The same is with Mergestone, if we have to split stones further (because we can't give you 0.5 of a stone) we lose 50% of worth again.

__________________

Before sending a PM, read the PM rules
If Supermoderators or moderators do not listen or unjustly ignore your PMs, write a PM to me.
Heresy grows from idleness.

02-05-2009 11:14

Mortis
Emperor

Registration Date: 05-01-2007
Posts: 1,159
Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: BoS exLead

Thread Starter Thread Started by Mortis

quote:

Originally posted by Szeszej
Soulstone = 1x Mergestone + 2x Lifestone

Ok, once more. Where is the calculation for the equation you have just copied from well of souls?

quote:

Originally posted by Szeszej
I think you still don't get it. Remember that if you wanted to split this soulstone further you would still get ~50% of what is worth so effectively if you split soulstone twice you get 25% of what it was originally worth.

I get it pretty clear, but this is not what we are talking about. I know that half from a half is quarter.

quote:

Originally posted by Szeszej
The same is with Mergestone, if we have to split stones further (because we can't give you 0.5 of a stone) we lose 50% of worth again.

No need to split it futher, you can give us half of its value in lesser stone very easily.

quote:

Originally posted by Szeszej
1 ms is split into 1.5 ls

Once again, where did you get this from if you don't count each stone's worth in bs to determine how they should be split?

__________________
"The brightest light is invisible. It shines through your deeds. And warms the universe."

"Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind."

02-05-2009 11:39

Szeszej
Administrator

Registration Date: 02-21-2007
Posts: 1,863
Location: Poland
Clan: Overlords

All the equations are in Well of Souls tab. I don't know what do you need more.

I yet again stress that splitting a mergestone is a 2 step process (2 splits) because we have to give you 0.5 of ls and because of the 2nd split the outcome is not exactly 50% of mergestone's worth.

I just don't know what I have to add more to expain it. All the calculations for how the second split works are in my post above.

__________________

Before sending a PM, read the PM rules
If Supermoderators or moderators do not listen or unjustly ignore your PMs, write a PM to me.
Heresy grows from idleness.

02-05-2009 19:51

Mortis
Emperor

Registration Date: 05-01-2007
Posts: 1,159
Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: BoS exLead

Thread Starter Thread Started by Mortis

quote:

Originally posted by Szeszej
Soulstone = 1x Mergestone + 2x Lifestone

Ok, one more time. Where is the calculation for the equation you have just copied from well of souls? And now forget about the Mergestone.

__________________
"The brightest light is invisible. It shines through your deeds. And warms the universe."

"Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind."

02-05-2009 20:06

DemonDude2
Lord

Registration Date: 11-18-2008
Posts: 483
Location: United Counties of Ireland :D
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: >:D

Ok.. I know that we are only the english, but were all confused

A merge stone is valued at 150
150 halfed once is 75

Sorted

-------------------

The biggest stone that fits into that is 1 life stone

Sorted

------------------

A lifestones value is 50, so thats 75-50=25 .. so theres a value of 25 left..

Sorted

------------------

Now, are u halfing this 25? . this does not make sense, it is already a half of what it should be, so it doesnt need halfed again..

Lets assume it is not halfed again.
The lowest amount of stones that fits into this 25 in one step is 2 heart stones and 5 blood stones
Each heart stone is worth 10, and each blood stone is worth 1, so in total we have 25

Thats the 25 we see... and as a life stones value is 50, 25 would be 0.5 of a lifestone as 0.5 is the same as one half...

So were are we going going wrong.. ... Yes you cant give a half of a life stone, but you can give a half of its value in stones, and using the system you yourselves made for auctions, 2 heart stones and 5 blood stones is half a life stones worth

Edit: There ya go mortis, sorry i keep editing, ive a an hour free until CC comes home Pleased

__________________

'Imagine waking up, and finding out you have the wrong blankey'

This post has been edited 6 time(s), it was last edited by DemonDude2: 02-05-2009 20:21.

02-05-2009 20:10

Mortis
Emperor

Registration Date: 05-01-2007
Posts: 1,159
Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Race in game: Absorber
Clan: BoS exLead

Thread Starter Thread Started by Mortis

Yes, thats how we see it should be done, but it seems Szeszej is showing us really strange calculations leading to current state equation. Well only for MS and LS, SS and HS split value is correct, but he is quite unable to understand what we want from him.

edit: dont use such color, its unreadable.

__________________
"The brightest light is invisible. It shines through your deeds. And warms the universe."

"Sow the wind, reap the whirlwind."

This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Mortis: 02-05-2009 20:17.

02-05-2009 20:16

Szeszej
Administrator

Registration Date: 02-21-2007
Posts: 1,863
Location: Poland
Clan: Overlords

DemonDude I've already written that we don't take bs value as the base for our calculation and I strongly suggest that you read and understand my "strange" calculations because I have nothing to add to this discussion.

__________________

Before sending a PM, read the PM rules
If Supermoderators or moderators do not listen or unjustly ignore your PMs, write a PM to me.
Heresy grows from idleness.

02-05-2009 21:25

Pages (2): [1] 2 next »

Tree Structure | Board Structure

Jump to:

Official Blood Wars Board » Blood Wars » Game system » Splitting stones